Hermetically.net

[12/5/12 4:02:22 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Hai.
[12/5/12 4:07:54 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Hey protag
[12/5/12 4:07:57 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Read LVX
[12/5/12 4:07:59 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: again
[12/5/12 4:08:00 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: do it
[12/5/12 4:08:03 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: do it fgt
[12/5/12 4:08:04 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: <3
[12/5/12 4:08:32 PM] PROTAGONIST: Oh dear god you’re encouraging me to do that?
[12/5/12 4:08:45 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Yes
[12/5/12 4:08:53 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Now tell me the meaning of it
[12/5/12 4:08:54 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: :3c
[12/5/12 4:08:56 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: ;3
[12/5/12 4:09:26 PM] PROTAGONIST: Well it describes the true nature of the HGA
[12/5/12 4:09:58 PM] PROTAGONIST: It’s really a debunking of sorts.
[12/5/12 4:10:20 PM] PROTAGONIST: It makes sure the idea of the HGA is divorced from preconceived notions accumulated from slave religions.
[12/5/12 4:10:33 PM] PROTAGONIST: The myth of purity, for example.
[12/5/12 4:11:02 PM] PROTAGONIST: The idea of asceticism as a virtue.
[12/5/12 4:11:40 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: mmmhmm~
[12/5/12 4:11:45 PM] PROTAGONIST: This had, though the Golden Dawn, filtered into the HGA concept. Hell, if you look at /Sacred Magic/ for example, you see both those ideas present strongly.
[12/5/12 4:11:58 PM] PROTAGONIST: People say that we owe a lot to the Golden Dawn and maybe we do
[12/5/12 4:12:26 PM] PROTAGONIST: But that doesn’t change the fact that they had a pretty toxic mindset, mostly derived from works like /Sacred Magic/ and other medieval grimoires.
[12/5/12 4:12:37 PM] PROTAGONIST: …does any of this make sense to you?
[12/5/12 4:12:59 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Yep.
[12/5/12 4:13:34 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: The suffering from the GD is due to lolchristianity, lolcelibacy, lolvictorianism, lolinternalpolitics, and lolego.
[12/5/12 4:13:49 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Also, the hunger games thing
[12/5/12 4:13:52 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: I read on your blog
[12/5/12 4:13:55 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: that’s hilarious.
[12/5/12 4:14:00 PM] PROTAGONIST: dude I kn
[12/5/12 4:14:27 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: BUT, it /sorta/ makes sense in a very weird way to me
[12/5/12 4:15:42 PM] PROTAGONIST: But anyways, I would say almost that LXV is a genealogy of the HGA concept
[12/5/12 4:16:06 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Yeah, I would say that it a good interpretation indeed.
[12/5/12 4:16:15 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: there are also spiritual lessons in thar too.
[12/5/12 4:16:23 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Like how everyone is a special snowflake.
[12/5/12 4:16:29 PM] PROTAGONIST: what
[12/5/12 4:16:34 PM] PROTAGONIST: The spiritual lesson
[12/5/12 4:16:37 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: And that you shouldn’t get complacent or content with one thing.
[12/5/12 4:16:40 PM] PROTAGONIST: It changed the way I think of the HGA
[12/5/12 4:17:04 PM] PROTAGONIST: Also it’s a much older form of genealogy than I’m used to.
[12/5/12 4:17:18 PM] PROTAGONIST: In fact Heidegger and Foucault probably wouldn’t call it genealogy at all
[12/5/12 4:17:20 PM] PROTAGONIST: Why?
[12/5/12 4:17:31 PM] PROTAGONIST: Because it presupposes that the HGA actually exists as an entity
[12/5/12 4:18:01 PM] PROTAGONIST: In genealogy you’re supposed to tear something apart, but what Crowley has done is tear something apart and replace it with it’s remains.
[12/5/12 4:18:19 PM] PROTAGONIST: And you know what? The remains are better
[12/5/12 4:18:23 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Oh you and your -s-t-u-p-i-d-  err silly continentialism
[12/5/12 4:18:24 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: :3c
[12/5/12 4:18:47 PM] PROTAGONIST: …I know I should really work on keeping that out of my reading of these texts but it’s so hard.
[12/5/12 4:18:51 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: It can have a genealogy and exist as an entity.
[12/5/12 4:18:57 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Things change over time.
[12/5/12 4:19:02 PM] PROTAGONIST: Not in the later use of the term.
[12/5/12 4:19:20 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Womany rulers, Manly rulers, Bothly rulers, Etc.
[12/5/12 4:20:04 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: In fact, if you want to have an overarching genealogy, you’d have to take everything back to the bigbang and all kabbalah and stuff.
[12/5/12 4:21:38 PM] PROTAGONIST: Yes, but when you’re doing this genealogy, are you looking for an origin point?
[12/5/12 4:21:42 PM] PROTAGONIST: An original form?
[12/5/12 4:22:11 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Genealogies aren’t really generally supposed to be overarching though, that’s the point.
[12/5/12 4:22:37 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: they are just a tool, a sort of metaphorical microscope to examine how things changed over time and when and mostly why.
[12/5/12 4:22:46 PM] PROTAGONIST: Yes, exactly.
[12/5/12 4:23:10 PM] PROTAGONIST: I’m saying though, even in it’s method LXV deconstructs the Golden Dawn mindset
[12/5/12 4:23:29 PM] PROTAGONIST: The very idea of a genealogy of the sort that’s being done is antithetical to the Golden Dawn mindset.
[12/5/12 4:24:22 PM] PROTAGONIST: Does this make sense to you?
[12/5/12 4:24:27 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: No shiz, sherlawk.
[12/5/12 4:24:36 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: GD has a ton of negative baggage
[12/5/12 4:24:42 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: even to this day, meng.
[12/5/12 4:26:41 PM] PROTAGONIST: But really, it’s a deconstruction of the earlier mindset about the HGA.
[12/5/12 4:27:27 PM] PROTAGONIST: And it’s fucking creepy because I had that mindset
[12/5/12 4:27:38 PM] PROTAGONIST: And so do a lot of people
[12/5/12 4:28:01 PM] PROTAGONIST: I hear them online in hushed tones about “knowledge and conversation.”
[12/5/12 4:28:49 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: I dont even into understanding atm.
[12/5/12 4:29:02 PM] PROTAGONIST: What?
[12/5/12 4:29:04 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Explain to me this mindset, is it one where …?
[12/5/12 4:29:22 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Hushed tones, like oh, occultism so sekrit?
[12/5/12 4:29:24 PM] PROTAGONIST: The HGA is divine in the old aeon sense of the term divine.
[12/5/12 4:29:34 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: fukkit
[12/5/12 4:29:36 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Ecksplain dis
[12/5/12 4:29:47 PM] PROTAGONIST: It’s a top-down model
[12/5/12 4:30:12 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Oh, so what, jesus was generous enough to grant you a HGA?
[12/5/12 4:30:38 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: From some far-off mystical college of angels in their 24 zodiacal houses?
[12/5/12 4:30:53 PM] PROTAGONIST: No, not exactly, but close, but not exactly. The Golden Dawn mindset isn’t exactly Christian, but it is old aeon.
[12/5/12 4:31:03 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: It’s a tad jewy.
[12/5/12 4:31:08 PM] PROTAGONIST: At the top you have what the Golden Dawn called “The Lord of the Universe” and he manifests to us as our “Higher Selves.” (their terminology.)
[12/5/12 4:31:20 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Ah. alright.
[12/5/12 4:31:25 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: But that’s not too far off, is it?
[12/5/12 4:31:37 PM] PROTAGONIST: From the truth, or from Christianity?
[12/5/12 4:32:05 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: I’m not sure how to explain.
[12/5/12 4:33:13 PM] PROTAGONIST: Basically, it all comes down to the Platonist idea that reality flows from a single source or origin point, and the farther you are from that source, the more deracinated things are, and less worthy of our time.
[12/5/12 4:33:37 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: It’s more like you’re just using it as an anchor but your anchor has to be good enough, or something. Not _exactly_ sure how to describe the relationship between HGA, “Lord”, and Us.
[12/5/12 4:33:58 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Ah, yeah protag.
[12/5/12 4:34:10 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Don’t agree with that at all. So that’s good.
[12/5/12 4:34:59 PM] PROTAGONIST: Of course this all has interesting Qabalistic implications.
[12/5/12 4:35:25 PM] PROTAGONIST: I’ve been searching like mad to see if Crowley addressed them, but I don’t know enough about qabala yet to really say
[12/5/12 4:35:41 PM] PROTAGONIST: But basically if we take this mindset seriously we have to in some respects reverse the Tree.
[12/5/12 4:35:57 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: hurr, no, don’t do that.
[12/5/12 4:36:01 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: just think different.
[12/5/12 4:36:18 PM] PROTAGONIST: No, I’m not saying we privilege Malkuth over Tiphareth or something.
[12/5/12 4:36:29 PM] PROTAGONIST: I’m saying we see it as building up rather than filtering down
[12/5/12 4:36:55 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Yeah, Well I see it true but I see it slant too.
[12/5/12 4:37:03 PM] PROTAGONIST: How so?
[12/5/12 4:37:11 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Well, the way most people view kabbalah is that They’re like these perfect shining sphere of energy that need to bounce off super magickal kether light
[12/5/12 4:37:22 PM] PROTAGONIST: Yes exactly. And that’s wrong.
[12/5/12 4:37:25 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: But then you have a problem there, because that’s wrong
[12/5/12 4:37:27 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: in short
[12/5/12 4:37:54 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Because then there would be degradation.
[12/5/12 4:38:00 PM] PROTAGONIST: Kether is an attainment that rests on the backs of the other sephiroth, Tiphareth specifically.
[12/5/12 4:38:09 PM] PROTAGONIST: It isn’t an “origin point”
[12/5/12 4:38:21 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: And the places on kabbalah…..the places between the paths and the spherioth
[12/5/12 4:38:28 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: they might as well not exist at all.
[12/5/12 4:38:41 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Eh, Protag, I don’t agree totally with that.
[12/5/12 4:38:48 PM] PROTAGONIST: How so?
[12/5/12 4:38:56 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Whereas, I see it more like a grand mountain range.
[12/5/12 4:39:05 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: With little retreats atop each mountain
[12/5/12 4:39:12 PM] PROTAGONIST: You’ve used that analogy several times.
[12/5/12 4:39:16 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: and easier paths than others, and suchlike.
[12/5/12 4:39:42 PM] PROTAGONIST: But does that imply their equal?
[12/5/12 4:39:47 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: But it’s also geometric, It’s like, pi, there were just going to be the kabbalah because that’s how things work.
[12/5/12 4:39:55 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: No, they just have different qualities.
[12/5/12 4:40:08 PM] PROTAGONIST: That I agree with.
[12/5/12 4:40:35 PM] PROTAGONIST: And I think your view isn’t bad. I’m kind of waffling between it and the idea of them as successive attainment.
[12/5/12 4:40:56 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: I view it like a giant waveform, too.
[12/5/12 4:41:13 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: like a rock leaning on another, floating endlessly in space and spiralling around.
[12/5/12 4:41:19 PM] PROTAGONIST: Remember: once the A.’.A.’. initiate reaches Kether, they don’t stay there.
[12/5/12 4:41:23 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: The red and blue interlocking~
[12/5/12 4:41:40 PM] PROTAGONIST: They fall back down, with the wisdom they’ve learned at kether, and find a home somewhere else.
[12/5/12 4:42:47 PM] PROTAGONIST: That wouldn’t be true if the Qabala were about union with a mythical origin point.
[12/5/12 4:41:55 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: I somewhat disagree with that. There are cycles of continual renewal.
[12/5/12 4:42:04 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Anyways, dont want to argue with that.
[12/5/12 4:43:00 PM] PROTAGONIST: Why not?
[12/5/12 4:43:50 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: lel
[12/5/12 4:44:18 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: Thelema: Spiritual Atheism since 1904~
[12/5/12 4:44:29 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: I’m imagining a commercial for it now
[12/5/12 4:44:32 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: on the side of a bus
[12/5/12 4:44:37 PM] PROTAGONIST: It’s only atheistic if you have an Old Aeon view of divinity.
[12/5/12 4:44:52 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: It’s not atheistic.
[12/5/12 4:45:18 PM] “AzureBiscuit”☥: But it is to most, or as good as.
[12/5/12 4:45:34 PM] PROTAGONIST: That’s because we’re in a liminal state.
[12/5/12 4:45:41 PM] PROTAGONIST: As a civilization, I mean

Filed under: Thelema by Protagonist at 5:27 pm
Tags: christianity, crowley, golden dawn, lxv, magick, Qabala, thelema
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This is a really good reference for how Liber XXV, the Star Ruby should be done. The only thing I can really say negative about it is that when doing the paean she doesn’t really give each part of it in the voice of the sign.

What do I mean by that? Well, the idea is that, when giving the sign puella, you actually make your voice sound like a young girl. Puer, you try to sound like a young boy, and vir, you actually try to sound like a man, etc. It’s just the way I learned to do it.

Filed under: Magick, Thelema by Protagonist at 2:32 am
Tags: crowley, magick, Star Ruby, thelema
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So I just finished reading Lon Milo Duquette’s “fairytale” about the Golden Dawn, Aleister Crowley – Revolt of the Magicians. I have to say I rather liked it. It’s available for Kindle here. I generally prefer science fiction, but occasionally will delve into occult fiction, though its rarely done well. The book is told mostly from Crowley’s perspective as he meets and tries to learn from the other members of the Golden Dawn. It has surprisingly little to do with what actually happened, but there are some interesting anecdotes I’ve heard elsewhere interwoven with the story.

Filed under: Uncategorized by Protagonist at 10:16 am
Tags: crowley, fiction, golden dawn, magick, occult
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Well, I’m not quite sure what is meant by this question. Presumably, what is being asked is, “Why do you keep mentioning Thelema?” or even “Why are you studying Thelema?” I can answer that easily enough.

Firstly, I would like to say that I am not a Thelemite in the slightest. Nor am I really a chaote, or anything else. I say that because I simply haven’t the experience to truly call myself any of these things. I aspire to be a chaote, it’s true, but that doesn’t really mean much, now does it? I am nothing, nobody important or special. I am very driven to become something, but I am nothing right now.

I am extremely interested in magick. Always have been. It has been, however, only recently that I developed the necessary means to pursue my interest. Before, I was too scattered, too drawn apart by too many different things and people. That has changed, and now I have a real chance to study magick. So I am.

I realize magick is one thing, but why Thelema in particular? Because, quite simply, it keeps rearing its head. Everywhere I look in the magickal world, I see Aleister Crowley’s influence. I mean, he’s the reason people spell it with a K these days. Thelema is extremely influential in almost all modern magickal traditions. Even Wicca is influenced by Thelema.

So I figured that if I wanted to study magick, I needed to confront Thelema at some point, and there’s no time like the present.

There is also a practical reason for my study of Thelema. I am very keen on learning magick from others, and making friends. Only so much can be learned from books. And, well, what do you know? At present, if I want to study magic in the flesh, my options are limited. In my area there are several Wiccan covens (whom I always seem to rub the wrong way) and the Ordo Templi Orientis. Of these groups, the O.T.O. is the only one actively teaching magick.

So I hang out with Thelemites, study Thelema, and read Crowley. At this stage I think it will help my development quite a bit. I could be wrong, but I’ve got to try.

Filed under: Magick, Thelema by Protagonist at 3:36 pm
Tags: crowley, magick, thelema
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I found a documentary on Aleister Crowley. 90% of what I know about the guy is coming from this thing, and it says some pretty crazy stuff. I’m not sure what to believe. Did he really run around Victorian England doing all these crazy things?

My favorite Crowley anecdote doesn’t come from the documentary. I’m not even sure where I heard it, but it fascinates me quite a bit. Apparently someone asked Crowley to demonstrate his occult powers, so he went walking down the street and picked a person in the crowd at random. He imitated their posture and walk for awhile, then suddenly fell to the ground. The person in question tumbled too, and was very confused.

You have to admire the gall it takes to try something like that. I mean, guy was good. This is coming from weak pathetic me, who can’t do anything of the sort.

Filed under: Magick, Thelema by Protagonist at 7:02 pm
Tags: crowley, magick, thelema
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